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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Mon Jan 27, 2014 6:55 pm 
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if the write up was read. the supplier and material code is posted

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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Mon Mar 10, 2014 2:03 pm 
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Whats the part number on the EL falcon alternator? I think i fucked up and ordered the wrong one.

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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 8:49 pm 
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Has anyone upgraded a twin dizzy 12a alternator on here? Wondering what will mount up, 72 RX2.

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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Tue May 20, 2014 11:16 pm 
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The Bug Has Bitten

Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2002 3:54 am
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Location: finishing the Rx7
Just thought I'd add another option here..
02 Mazda Bravo alternator..
Bought one for 99c off ebay. Standard ASI 3 pin with B+ and Neg chassis..
Also has a twin V 17mm pulley as standard... Win Win..
Wired into a series 1 Rx7 12a,
A connection went to + before fusable links,
S connection went to the stator spade terminal,
I connection went to Bl/g alt light wire after unplugging external regulator.
B+ to battery via a 100a fuse,
- to battery via alt chassis..

Nice and easy.. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Tue Feb 10, 2015 11:46 am 
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Would this be the correct diode to use for this alternator wiring? it's rated at 10a 50V

http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/10PCS-10A-50 ... 35c8bf82d2

If not, where do I get the correct diode for this alternator wiring? Thanks


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808rx3externalregtointernalregalt.jpg
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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Wed Jul 01, 2015 8:51 pm 
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Hi guys, currently doing the el falcon alternator to series 5 13bt.. Having an issue of the positive stud coming out of the alternator hitting the tps which is in the standard location, anyone got a solution to this?

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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2016 1:50 pm 
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just thought I would throw this in as i went from a series 1 to series 2 alternator id say it will work with the other alternators also if you have a series 1 rx7 and up grade to internal reg alternator.

http://www.rx7club.com/1st-generation-s ... de-967330/

link above is were i got the info not my handy work.

cheers

Ok, before I start, I know there is a thread in the archives that outlines how to do what I am going to tell you here. That thread is absolutely HORRIBLE. Showing how to wire a relay using a text diagram = epic fail and there is a general lack of information within that thread. Basically it didn't help at all. I never did figure out the relay wiring from that thread.


So, to begin, this "how to" is to explain the process to properly upgrade a 79-80 externally regulated alternator to a 81-88 internally regulated alternator while retaining proper function of your dash lights and choke ****, all without adding any extra wires. There are a few reasons one might want to do this. First one is obvious, regulator or alternator has failed and you can't locate a new/rebuilt one. There are loads of good 81-88 alternators out there for real cheap. Reason two, you need more electrical power to supply a more powerful stereo. 86-88 alternators can do this, along with the swap to a GM 105 amp alternator, both of which are internally regulated. Reason the third, internally regulated alternators tend to be more reliable (personal experience, others may refute this).

So, I might as well start off with a list of suggested tools and parts.

Tools:
-#2 phillips screwdriver
-8mm socket
-10mm socket
-12mm socket
-14mm socket
-Ratchet handle
-15mm combination wrench
-Wire stripper/crimper
-Heat gun

Parts:
-2 12V automotive relays of the 5 pin type
-14 and 18 gauge spade terminal connectors, insulated
-14 and 18 gauge butt connectors, non insulated (insulated ones can be substituted)
-18 gauge 1/4" crimp on ring terminals
-1/8" and 3/16" heat shrink tubing
-Short length of 18 gauge wire, about 1 foot will do.

Once you've gathered all that up, along with your choice of alternator, its time to start working. First thing you want to do is disconnect your battery negative before doing any work on the electrical system. Second thing you want to do is remove the old alternator and regulator. For those that aren't sure, the regulator is located on the drivers side inner fender close to the firewall. A haynes manual will show this fairly well. Cut the connectors off of the regulator leaving about 3" of extra wire on the connector. DO NOT CUT THE BODY SIDE OF THE CONNECTOR FROM THE HARNESS!!!! That side will be left unmodified, only the regulator side will be cut off. Also, while you have your cutters out, snip the 4 pin connector off that used to plug into the alternator. This will not be reused.

Now its time to start wiring. Basically what you will be doing is replicating the way the regulator works with the choke relay and the dash light/voltmeter using one relay, and the other supplies a switched power for the IGN+ terminal of the alternator. You may ask why I chose to send the switched power through a relay and I will explain that a little later.

Before I go into any wiring, a few basics in crimping, soldering, and insulating connections. There are a few different types of connectors you can use, non insulated, basic insulated, then weather tight insulated with heat shrink built in. I prefer to use non insulated connectors crimped on and insulated with heat shrink. Makes a nice joint that isn't as likely to fail, and if I am real **** about it I can even solder them for an indestructable joint. Another option is to bypass the butt connectors and just solder and heat shrink the wires together. This works well also, if your good at soldering. These joints are the most reliable out of all, but also the hardest to accomplish. Weather tight connectors work well but aren't as clean as non insulated with heat shrink. The lowest quality connection is with the basic insulated connector. Usually too bulky to heat shrink, and not at all weather tight without it. If crimped properly, they provide a decent connection that will last quite a while inside a car, but in an engine compartment or underbody, they won't last very long at all.

Now on to the good stuff. First we will wire up the 5 pin relay. This relay will have pin numbers of 30, 85, 86, 87, and 87a. Pin 30 is your relay energize, 85 is ground, 86 is high current in, and 87/87a are switched high current out. To make this relay work in place of the regulators function, it needs to be wired a specific way. Throughout this wiring process, I will be quoting wire colors on the body side of the regulator connectors (the side you didn't cut off). Any wire color I call out, just follow it through the connectors to determine what wire you have to make your relay connection to.

Pin 30 goes to the black with yellow stripe wire on the 6 pin connector
Pin 85 goes to a chassis ground
Pin 86 goes to a chassis ground
Pin 87 goes to the yellow with blue stripe wire on the 6 pin connector
Pin 87a goes to the yellow with no stripe wire on the single pin connector

Got that done right? Well its time to move on. The second relay will be providing switched power to the IGN+ terminal of the alternator. This wire needs a switched 12V source that will pull a bit of current. This could potentially overload the 15 amp switched circuit available at the 6 pin regulator connector. This is why I added the second relay. This relay draws its main power from the white with red stripe wire on the old regulators 6 pin connector. A standard 4 pin relay will work fine for this one. The 4 pin relay will have all the same pin numbers as the 5 pin, except pin 87a will be missing. The wiring for it goes as follows:

Pin 30 goes to the black with light green stripe wire on the 6 pin connector
Pin 85 goes to a chassis ground
Pin 86 goes to the yellow with red stripe wire on the 6 pin connector
Pin 87 goes to the white with black stripe wire on the 6 pin connector

Once you have this wiring complete, mount your two relays with the old regulator screws with your chassis ground wires under these screws. They provide a convenient grounding spot. This is what the short length of 18 gauge wire and ring terminals are for.

Now its time to move to the alternator. Depending what alternator you chose, you may need to use a different spacer for the solid mount to the water pump housing. I found a pack of 3/8" washers to work well for this task with the 88 alternator I installed. Wiring is very simple to the alternator at this point. You will need a 2 pin T style male connector (very common on the RX-7's). Hopefully you got this connector when you scavenged your alternator. If not, they are easy to find, and even your local auto store might have the connector. If all else fails, you can use regular female 1/4" spade terminals with heat shrink tight around any exposed parts of the terminal.

The main 10 gauge wire that has a ring terminal on it attaches in the same way as with the original alternator, no modification required. Wiring of the 2 pin connector goes as follows from the original alternator connector wiring:

Upper horizontal pin goes to the white with black stripe wire (should be your switched 12V relay)
Lower vertical pin goes to the black with yellow stripe wire (your 5 pin relay)

Once all is done, clean up any loose wiring, double check that everything is connected, and make it look all pretty if you want. Double check that your alternator belt is tight and routed properly. Now its time for the first start. If everything was wired properly, your dash lights should function just as they did before.

I can post pictures upon request, once I take a few, along with a wiring diagram if my long winded wording is too hard to understand. I feel this is the best way to do this conversion. It makes for a clean, almost stock looking installation and guarantees a stock functioning charging system, all for only about $15 in extra parts. Well worth the investment IMO. Hope others find this useful for their conversions.


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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 8:07 pm 
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Posts: 56
Location: Gold Coast
Hi guys, would I be correct in thinkin this alt is a S2/3/4 and should follow the first diagram in first post?
Cheers


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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 8:38 pm 
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Location: S Devon - ENGLAND
I do not think it is a S3 as it has a Capacitor/suppressor on the rear, the S3 looks like this with the cooling fins inside together with the regulator & rectifier & is a 55amp as per pictures:-

Image

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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 10:28 pm 
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Location: Gold Coast
DKWW2000 wrote:
I do not think it is a S3 as it has a Capacitor/suppressor on the rear, the S3 looks like this with the cooling fins inside together with the regulator & rectifier & is a 55amp as per pictures


Cheers...Yeah it doesn't look the same body wise, S2 maybe, it has the T shape connect so should be safe to follow the diagram "I hope lol"


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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 11:12 pm 
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Location: Melbourne
That's a s2 rx7 alternator.

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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2017 8:59 pm 
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Hi guys, followed the RX3 to series 2 schematic and worked fine shutting off with key, after rebuilding motor and reconnected wiring as before removing motor.

Problem is now the car wouldn't turn off with key, seems as if power is fed back to the ignition wire but not via the diode route as diode measures correctly with MM.

Would I be correct in thinking there is a internal diode in alt/reg preventing the straight through wire feeding back keeping the ignition wire active? So internal reg failure.

Disconnecting alt B+ and L/R wires and running off battery only, motor shuts off with key.

Cheers
Rob


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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 5:27 pm 
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BAIT wrote:
Hi guys, followed the RX3 to series 2 schematic and worked fine shutting off with key, after rebuilding motor and reconnected wiring as before removing motor.

Problem is now the car wouldn't turn off with key, seems as if power is fed back to the ignition wire but not via the diode route as diode measures correctly with MM.

Would I be correct in thinking there is a internal diode in alt/reg preventing the straight through wire feeding back keeping the ignition wire active? So internal reg failure.

Disconnecting alt B+ and L/R wires and running off battery only, motor shuts off with key.

Cheers
Rob


usually this issue would go straight to fan relay and see if it has the wiring buggered around and backfeeding the IG 12V when winding down
, and other times in some cars it is having the L/R wires on wrong positions

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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 7:30 pm 
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Location: Gold Coast
bumpstart wrote:
BAIT wrote:
Hi guys, followed the RX3 to series 2 schematic and worked fine shutting off with key, after rebuilding motor and reconnected wiring as before removing motor.

Problem is now the car wouldn't turn off with key, seems as if power is fed back to the ignition wire but not via the diode route as diode measures correctly with MM.

Would I be correct in thinking there is a internal diode in alt/reg preventing the straight through wire feeding back keeping the ignition wire active? So internal reg failure.

Disconnecting alt B+ and L/R wires and running off battery only, motor shuts off with key.

Cheers
Rob


usually this issue would go straight to fan relay and see if it has the wiring buggered around and backfeeding the IG 12V when winding down
, and other times in some cars it is having the L/R wires on wrong positions


Hi Bump
The wiring is as in pic below (didn't include fuses and Alt light setup)
Double checked L/R aren't in wrong position today, all good...Apart from the black ign wire activating coil relays , there's nothing else hooked up to black ign wire in engine bay.
I will probably run power feed to coil relays direct from battery instead off ALT/Battery wire.
Just don't understand how the coil relays could be held on, it worked before and not now after reinstalling motor? Has to be a failed internal regulator.


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 Post subject: Re: Alternator upgrades
PostPosted: Fri Mar 31, 2017 10:12 pm 
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at the cost of a few cents . would you not change the diode anyway?
i usually run three 3A as a gang ( yes i know they dont shed evenly as they warm ) so i have a proxy 9A

only time ive seen it go bad, and they tested ok to me on DMM
but still one must have leaked was the relay would buzz when the light was activated until the alternator kicked in

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